JUANA SUMMERS, HOST:
When President Trump nominated Linda McMahon as secretary of education for his second term in office, this was his main directive to her.
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PRESIDENT DONALD TRUMP: I want Linda to put herself out of a job.
SUMMERS: Put herself out of a job - in essence, dismantle the Department of Education. This week, the Trump administration took a big step toward reaching that goal. It announced it would shift several Education Department functions to other government agencies. The department was established by Congress, and it can only be eliminated by Congress. John King was education secretary in the Obama administration, and we called him up to get his thoughts on the changes. He joins me now. Welcome.
JOHN KING: Thanks so much.
SUMMERS: One of the administration's main arguments for making this change is they say American students are floundering after the pandemic. We see that American students still struggle with things like math and reading. Couldn't that be an argument that it's time to shake it up, try something new?
KING: It's an argument, I think, for focus, and this move of offices from the department to different agencies in an incoherent fashion is the opposite of focus. It's a distraction. We should be focused on things like intensive, high-quality tutoring, which we know helps students make up ground. We should be focused on trying to attract and retain the best possible teachers, and yet the administration is cutting programs that support teacher preparation. So this is the wrong approach to what really is a very urgent crisis. Our performance today is below where it was before COVID. We should be doing more, not less.
SUMMERS: Current Education Secretary Linda McMahon makes the argument that these moves will actually make things more efficient and will improve services. It sounds like that is not something you agree with.
KING: Well, look, it's going to be very confusing for schools, school districts, higher ed institutions, to even know who to call. The early evidence from one of their moves- which was to move some career and technical education programming over to the Department of Labor - is that it has slowed the distribution of money and made things more confusing for educators. It's not helping.
SUMMERS: I want to ask you about one specific change that was announced last week. It was the decision to put the Labor Department in charge of managing Title I funding, which of course is money that helps schools support low-income students. If the money is still available, help us understand why it matters if there's a different department distributing it.
KING: Well, you want folks involved in the distribution of the money who understand the program, who understand how the dollars are going to be used. You want them to be able to help provide guidance to school districts and schools about what the rules are that Congress has set up and to make sure that the dollars are responsibly used. Moving this over to another agency that has no experience in K-12 is only adding risk that the school districts won't have the help they need and that dollars won't reach the most vulnerable students.
SUMMERS: Not every function of the Education Department is moving to another agency. Things like civil rights, special education and student loans are all going to stay within the Education Department. Give us your sense of what you make of the decision to keep those in the Education Department rather than moving them elsewhere.
KING: Well, at this point, it's hard to know if this is just a next step in their effort to dismantle the department and they'll come back with other moves. You know, I think they're trying to navigate violating the law as they do this, right? They are doing the opposite of what Congress has set out. Congress created the Education Department. Congress appropriated funds to the Education Department. They're trying to get around that. I hope that the courts will intervene, and I hope that Congress will intervene.
SUMMERS: What do you hear from your colleagues, other leaders in education about what impact this might have on the nation's students?
KING: Well, people are very worried. They already are seeing the consequences of the dismantling of the office for civil rights. Regional offices have been closed, people have been laid off. And so if you are a victim of discrimination on the basis of race or sex or disability, you don't have anywhere to go. A large share of the complaints that come to the Education Department's Office for Civil Rights come from families of kids with disabilities who aren't getting the services they're entitled to. Without the Office for Civil Rights having adequate staff, those complaints go unaddressed, and those students go without the services they need to access education. That is immoral, from my perspective, and counter to who we are as Americans and what we believe about giving everyone opportunity.
SUMMERS: It's clear that access to a strong public education isn't equal in this country. If this is not the right way to improve things for American students, what is?
KING: Look, I would love to see things like investing in teacher training, tutoring, and after-school programs and early childhood programs so that kids growing up in difficult circumstances have a real shot. It would mean doubling the Pell Grant and making it possible for more low- and middle-income Americans to get a college education and get the skills they need for good jobs. We really need a president and an Education Department that want our schools to be the best in the world, not that are focused on shuffling activities from one agency to another.
SUMMERS: We've been speaking with John B King, former secretary of education under President Obama. He is currently Chancellor of the State University of New York. Thank you so much.
KING: Thank you. Transcript provided by NPR, Copyright NPR.
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